Firstly, it is unclear what homeopathy has to do with atheism. Reg: Yea… what? That would be where they think skepticism and rationality leads, of course!”. The agenda seems to be carefully crafted largely after McCreight’s own political views. Subscribe to Bishop Barron's YouTube Channel. [Long audience applause.] In group/our group members should be treated with respect and an assumption of equality. A self-educated attorney and atheist, Ingersoll was a Victorian-era rock star who could pack theaters from Texas to New York with people who came from hundreds of miles around to hear “The Great Agnostic” lecture against religion. Twas little more than casual dismissive insult, exhortation to GTFO and the mere assertion that a naysayer was irrational or similar, and thus presumably no more need be said in answer to their points. Whatever they may say they do. Demonizing men isn’t going to make them sympathetic to your cause. This is exactly what I see going on. Thanks very much – kind of you to say so! January 20, 2020 . In any case, the Atheism Plus website wound up picking a somewhat different symbol resembling an @ si… Now the A+ people want to take the stereotype that atheists are associated with all aspects of the modern “progressive” ideology and make it official. An Atheist has no religious belief. If there is to be an atheist movement at all, it should be to ensure that atheists are not discriminated against, but this is not to say that the atheist movement should not promote these sorts of things internally. Because the examples are infinite. You wrote “Surly Amy is the target of a harassment campaign. I think they believe that they have power, but the more they alienate people outside their little circle by insisting that everyone see everything exactly the way they do or risk being bullied and shunned, the more they deflate whatever power they did have. Here’s what I’d suggest. Atheists have to explain why there is both good and evil, whereas Christians can quickly explain the good and can even explain the evil. You highlighted many things that I initially thought about this A+ initiative and raised some points that I hadn’t considered. Gah. For video, ... mind here is, the first thing I mean by “plus,” is atheism plus basic moral values. Also, I would be very interested to learn the names of, oh, 10 people who are already Atheist+’ers (or whatever your preferred moniker will be). Barry:” If we all treated religions as hobbies, (which is really what religious practices are), the other problems become far more important than religions.” I am still surprised that more have not noticed it and spoken up. However, it is quite another matter if atheists, skeptics, humanists and the like threaten you with rape. You refer to her public details that Amy deliberately made public herself, in order to make money from her craft? Why You Should Go to Church. Not to mention that these folks taking such easy offense is good cause to become enraged!? My prediction is that they will predominantly be liberal/left-wingers. Reg: No, piss off. “I believe in social justice plus I’m an atheist”. [This speech was delivered before the Society of Separationists in 1976. I also feel that it lends support to the (sometimes harmful) notion of ‘atheist beliefs’. It just isn’t possible that they are wrong or are ill-equipped to lead. It is the opposite of theism, which is the belief that at least one god exists.A person who rejects belief in gods is called an atheist.Theism is the belief in one or more gods. This initiative only serves to divide Atheism, into Atheists, and Holier-Than-Thou-Atheists. That would be where they think skepticism and rationality leads, of course! Rebecca Watson still gets an un-ending tirade of rape threats. Maybe it’s even about money; that I really can’t tell, but I do know that delusions of grandeur are a huge part of this thing. Not only is it happening one corner, but most of my friends are not even talking about it. . For instance, one might be an atheist and be pro-life, or a socialist, or a preference utilitarian, etc. Because if you are a member of the other little splinter group, you are a fiend and a traitor. TAM is an annual meeting. What about supporting Palestine? However, in order to avoid confusion (since Smith has published a book under that same title), … I'm Not 'Blessed,' I'm An Atheist And I Don't Need God To Give Thanks Or Show Gratitude Since I’ve cut God out of my life, I have so much more room for everyone else. Krauss was lied about. There is some honest, legitimate criticism of the idea of creating a new atheist movement, but a lot of it simply seems to come from those […], GaylenePaula“Death threats and rape threats are not acceptable. What about those who maintain that gender role is a social construnct in which biology plays little or minimal part? 2.1.1 James S. Spiegal and unforgiveness as a cause of atheism At the very least, those who threaten with rape should be reported to the police. Paula Kirby was told to kill herself today. Atheists are doing their best to remove God from our nation’s future, and have even rewritten history to try to erase Him from our past. It’s like all perspective and reason have been deemed superfluous to requirements and jettisoned. To be honest, the whole thing is utterly ridiculous. Thunderf00t escaped, but now they have hypnotised Carrier, who was the last person in the FreeFromThoughtBlog hive to have acquiesced to such irrational bonkers insanity. Seriously, wtf is wrong with these people? I wasn’t aware of their previous treatment of Pamela Gay. One question I have regarding this whole A+ thing is “isn’t atheism good enough as it is?” I don’t see the point in adding a few extra things to it already. How can that be?” When I respond that my lack of belief in a divine being (or beings) has nothing to do with my beliefs on the proper punishment for murder, I have heard things back like “but . Notung: “The label ‘atheist’ doesn’t speak about other beliefs you might have, unless it would be contradictory …”. As we know, the term ‘atheist’ describes our lack of belief in (or denial of) the existence of gods. Where? I am constantly emailed by women who say they’re afraid to speak up, or don’t want to disclose their names because of the fear of the repercussions. Atheism Plus does not bury the “atheism” part but keeps it at the forefront of one’s socio-religious identity. And its usually not. Discover (and save!) The notion that offending religious sensibilities is par for the course but dare ye not offend the sacred ones for all are equal but some are more equal than others. . Brian: I do! you say you are an atheist . Attacks on individuals for expressing opinions should cease. As mentioned above, I’d have to agree with the 3rd point he makes – that […]. While he gave this talk back in October, it wasn’t online until now. For example, one cannot be both an atheist and believe in the Resurrection of Jesus, as belief in the Resurrection requires first that one believes in the Christian conception of God. Thanks for the comment! What happened to the First Amendment? Reg: People’s Front! That is important. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. * That is, if ‘atheism+’ becomes famous outside of a handful of blogs and lasts for more than a few weeks. When people find out that I am an atheist, they often assume that I subscribe to a over-arching “progressive” ideology and are surprised that I do not march in lock-step on a variety of political issues. It could be interesting to see McCreight poll those who support this new faction of Atheism on where they stand politically. With Talk, your phone will speak what you type. Atheism is not the priority. Update : @Got Proof I kind of need 3 sources and it has to be a 3 to 4 minute speech. It’s really hard to defend claims that one understands science, but it’s incredibly easy to defend one’s claims to a vague set of values that most people hold. Surly Amy is the target of a harassment campaign. Wagnerites might still hold these beliefs and are of course welcome to join feminist groups, but it does not make much sense for the Wagner Society itself to fight these causes. I certainly have the same worries as you do – that the common misconception that atheists believe x, y, z seems to be embodied in ‘atheism+’. Brian: I don’t want to sell this stuff, it’s only a job. Atheism plus is an attempt to define a new subgroup in the atheist movement - a subgroup that is concerned with atheism plus some elements of social justice. Yep, this is excellent. Atheists plus we fight homophobia and transphobia, Feel Free to discuss and Chill! Sickening. This also applies to things like homeopathy – we might be atheists plus homeopaths without contradiction. Avoided? Atheism is, in the broadest sense, an absence of belief in the existence of deities. That dissent, apart from being evil is also presented in religious language, a sin to be repented of, presumably the sincerity and acceptance of repentance to be judged by the hierarchy? It’s one component that can inform any number of worldviews. If I told that to the users of Freethought Blogs, they’d freak the fuck out. ! I know plenty of atheists in real life, and none of them are talking about Atheism+. Honestly, What Difference Does God Make? Mocking atheists is both hate speech and free speech. Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Someone actually thought that was funny. The heated exchange on intersectional feminism, social justice activism and Black Lives Matter was marred by insults which frequently bled into Smith … I thought freethought was beyond such trivial notions. With that in mind, it isn’t hard to see why I’m surprised that blogger Jen McCreight has started a new movement, or ‘wave’ of atheism: Atheism+. Thanks for the comment! A †, we’re Athesits… but we behave like Christians:. And finally, while women’s rights should be advocated, men’s rights shouldn’t be ignored. Certainly the use of such aggressive language such as ‘well you can just fuck off’ , ‘you’re either with us or against us’, is hardly likely to endear this nascent organisation, (or whatever it turns out to be), to many people who might have some worthwhile viewpoints to offer. The term atheism comes from the Greek word atheos, meaning godless. Another might be to prevent harm done by people peddling homeopathy as a substitute for real medicine, and this is a very worthwhile goal. Although Atheism Plus no longer has much of a presence within the atheist movement, many atheists affiliated with the faction continue to argue that the atheist community perpetuates inequality, has a “sexism problem” and that it is an “old boys’ club” (McCreight 2011). %PDF-1.3 I doubt they would support that idea (and nor would I), but why not? Crimes, on the other hand, should be immediately reported, although none have occurred outside of the online forums and blogosphere. 1) There is already something like this: humanism. The label ‘atheist’ doesn’t speak about other beliefs you might have, unless it would be contradictory to both be an atheist and hold that belief. It is atheism plus a condemnation of sexist, racist, or homophobic trolls. All wonderful points here. Filter. But it also isn’t new that vague, grandiose ideals get people excited. Considering the Atheism Plus movement as a whole, then, the topic of economic justice is more or less an afterthought. I have to agree with you and Abbie – making atheism a central feature is exclusionary and contradicts the concept of social justice. Is there already a committee, or some other form of body within the organization, with the power to do that? I think that, while not nearly as bad as Carrier’s, Jen’s statement that all non-plussers are garbage was an indication of things to come. 19 December, 2018. “These are only some of the stories I’ve seen.” “Enlightenment” is better than “Atheism+”. One thought on “ Importance of Atheism ” Atheist June 16, 2016. That begs the question, which forms of discrimination are not mentioned? They may be atheists, but they are second-rate atheists, of lower humanistic value than the A+’ers. Congratulations to Jen McCreight (hereafter JM) for putting forth an idea that struck a responsive chord. In August 2012, Jennifer McCreight founded a movement known as Atheism Plus that "applies skepticism to everything, including social issues like sexism, racism, politics, poverty, and crime." x�\K���ϯ��4�x���p�\ىA;��îֻ�W�(Ѷ�}���'�U�}��"W���wUWU?�7�K�ƕ�o]ծ��������ǟ���˷��o_ Reg: We’re the People’s Front of Atheism! Or the People’s Front for Judea? However, Hitchens had his critics in terms of his public debates. How the hell is that “doxxing”? I’m not sure that “serious” and not ego-driven are mutually exclusive. mind here is, the first thing I mean by “plus,” is atheism plus basic moral values. Update : @Got Proof I kind of need 3 sources and it has to be a 3 to 4 minute speech. Are you the Atheist People’s Front? Wave a flag of liberal vague values, and everyone who doesn’t take up the charge in your wake is against those liberal values. Do not care. Barbara Drescher wrote an excellent post about the issue of mission drift in the skeptical movement. This is a really good article, Notung. I hate the Religious already. If atheism+ appeals to some people, then I think they should go ahead join in with it. Atheos is derived from a, meaning "without," and theos, meaning “deity”. Reg: Oh, yeah? If we all treated religions as hobbies, (which is really what religious practices are), the other problems become far more important than religions. September 16, 2019 . In a follow-up post, McCreight illuminates her idea further: We are… So far, the so called A + movement has given me enough reasons to come to think of them as a godless Christian-like movement, or A †.. Then came the second wave of “New Atheists” like Dawkins and Hitchens, whose trademark was their unabashed public criticism of religion. Brian: Excuse me? Atheists should not be doing this. Notung is now at the Skeptic Ink Network! Ivanka Trump appears to … If not, why not simply put them together as one? Carrier may have simply chosen not to publish your comment. The comments within 20 minutes already showed the cracks developing when you try to herd the cats of ism’s. Atheism plus is an attempt to define a new subgroup in the atheist movement - a subgroup that is concerned with atheism plus some elements of social justice. Is this a trick question or something? I see this as nothing more than another bad response to criticism. 952 members in the AgainstAtheismPlus community. Maybe, fewer women are interested in the movement (just like, apparently from what I have read, fewer men than women are interested in church). 2.1 Atheists and ungracious/unforgiving attitudes. I have my anorak, several spiral-bound notepads, a 2b pencil, and a flask of weak lemon drink. If she had, she’d have missed out on seeing herself on CNN and Colbert. Reg: Yeah. CLS was told to commit suicide by jumping off a bridge. Fantastic post, Notung. Need I go on? ‘Atheist’ describes just one part of my belief system. It is one thing that people say bad things about you, especially on the internet. I have already seen requests for extra doctrines, like animal rights and so forth. They have nothing to do with atheism. Splitters. I hate the Religious as much as anybody. The global village does have a large group of village idiots. He also indicated about atheist meetings: "But to me the speakers and talks have often seemed repetitive: the same crew of jet-set skeptics giving the same … This is bound to be reflected in a movement with science at its heart. delusions of grandeur are what come to mind when I read that post. I wonder what blackmail they have over otherwise rational individuals in order to co-op them into their anti-feminist church cult? they were in the same bag as, for example, animist tribespeople who sacrifice and undertake all sorts of non-functional activities with regard to various imaginary entities. Yes, I think it is high time we learned who these atheists are, instead of just talking about what terrible people they are. One can do these things without harming the cause of social justice. You do it by being inclusive and friendly. Now I would like to talk about sexism in the light of male privilege. As is often the … Atheists will be used to mischaracterisations of their position. He also banned a transsexual for complaining about comparing the Catholic clergy to transexuals. )They filed suit against both the County of Palm Beach and the City of Boca Raton, where a 2017 ordinance prohibited the practice. We should be able to talk about these issues, but already ‘Atheism+’ seems unwelcoming to those who question it. You (and Abbie and Barbara) make excellent & important & astute points. Having been part of the atheist community for years Atheism Plus was a real eye opener into how some atheists (thankfully a fringe minority) can be so deluded by ideology (radical feminism) that they come across just as annoying as religious people. The people spearheading this including many of the bloggers and readers at FTB are mistaken in trying to make atheism into a worldview, or believing that it was when they became involved in the various organizations. However, it is certainly true that many atheists in America are focused on religion. They maintain that to date the United States has actually had four presidents who were atheists. It’s about ego. She sees atheism (as a movement) in its current form as a ‘Boy’s [sic] Club’, and makes an analogy with the ‘waves’ of feminism: It’s time for a new wave of atheism, just like there were different waves of feminism. http://shanebrady.com/post/29935153211/i-wont-be-joining-up-with-atheism-plus, Atheism + some mission-creep and potential confusion, http://freethoughtblogs.com/greta/2012/08/24/mencallmethings-fuckin-hoe-fuckin-feminazi-slut/, Why I am super-stoked about Atheism+ | One Man Wolfpack. your own Pins on Pinterest What about post-structuralist feminism? While we can speculate about women’s interests and whether they are genetic or socially conditioned, this is a pointless exercise when it comes to addressing the issue. What about a concern for the poor? Further, constant harping about how misogynistic this community is should cease immediately. Is this marginalizing, McCarthyite call to cull a Poe? I especially agree with point #3. By now, you’ve heard from Mr. Yeti and from me, Shermertron, that Carrier is a lying hypocrite who treats women poorly while leading the moral crusade he believes atheism should be.. Well, Carrier has finally responded. Judith: Are you sure? In my last post, I discussed white privilege and how to find out if you have it.Now I want to turn to another kind of privilege, one that is particularly relevant to the atheist community right now.
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